|
Post by Lex on Dec 22, 2010 19:56:22 GMT -5
Things like gouging our eyes out is figurative. Anytime that there is a parable, for that matter, it is (usually) figurative. Things like the stories that can be acted out are not figurative, unless they are in a parable. If it's in prophesy book, it's often figurative. Playing devil's advocate again: What dictates which is which? There aren't any disclaimers before each section saying that something is figurative, or that something is literal.
|
|
|
Post by nessieisreal on Dec 22, 2010 19:59:56 GMT -5
It takes time to learn to interpret what is what. It's hard to explain.
|
|
|
Post by Lex on Dec 22, 2010 20:37:14 GMT -5
It takes time to learn to interpret what is what. It's hard to explain. Sounds to me like it's open to interpretation. Which is the entire point. You can't say "this is figurative, this isn't" as though it's a fact. There's no way of telling. That's just how the bible is. Unfortunately, so many people fail to understand this.
|
|
|
Post by James McClelland on Dec 22, 2010 20:38:48 GMT -5
Bible is eh pretty cool guy, he burns jews and doesn't afraid of anything.
In all seriousness, the Bible is just another fictional story. But Catcher in the Rye is better.
|
|
|
Post by Joey on Dec 22, 2010 20:42:59 GMT -5
It takes time to learn to interpret what is what. It's hard to explain. Sounds to me like it's open to interpretation. Which is the entire point. You can't say "this is figurative, this isn't" as though it's a fact. There's no way of telling. That's just how the bible is. Unfortunately, so many people fail to understand this. The Roman Catholic church teaches that the Magesterium has the correct interpretation
|
|
|
Post by Lex on Dec 22, 2010 20:43:57 GMT -5
Sounds to me like it's open to interpretation. Which is the entire point. You can't say "this is figurative, this isn't" as though it's a fact. There's no way of telling. That's just how the bible is. Unfortunately, so many people fail to understand this. The Roman Catholic church teaches that the Magesterium has the correct interpretation Your point being...?
|
|
|
Post by nessieisreal on Dec 22, 2010 21:00:54 GMT -5
Interpretation is a skill that can be learned, but not explained. It's a lot like reading comprehension.
|
|
|
Post by Lex on Dec 22, 2010 21:16:20 GMT -5
Interpretation is a skill that can be learned, but not explained. It's a lot like reading comprehension. You seem to be acting like there's something I'm not understanding... But no, interpretation is not learned. It's something everyone does consciously or not.
|
|
vichilux
Star
Hatsune Miku LALALALALA :D
Posts: 699
|
Post by vichilux on Dec 22, 2010 21:43:44 GMT -5
Jussayin' ;D
|
|
|
Post by nessieisreal on Dec 22, 2010 22:10:26 GMT -5
Haha. Wow.
Alex: Sorry, I don't mean to be. The Bible, I will admitt, is a bit confusing. I have trouble with it, too. Interpretation seriously comes... naturally to some, and not to others. It can be learned and improved upon if persued.
|
|
|
Post by Lex on Dec 22, 2010 22:23:58 GMT -5
Haha. Wow. Alex: Sorry, I don't mean to be. The Bible, I will admitt, is a bit confusing. I have trouble with it, too. Interpretation seriously comes... naturally to some, and not to others. It can be learned and improved upon if persued. But remember, your interpretation is not anyone else's interpretation. What makes your interpretation right, and not anyone else's? Say, "doctor" Kent Hovind -- who believes that the entire bible is fact, and none of it is figurative. Again, what dictates which is figurative and what isn't? There aren't any disclaimers before each section saying that something is figurative, or that something is literal.
|
|
|
Post by krzych32 on Dec 22, 2010 22:46:02 GMT -5
Haha. Wow. Alex: Sorry, I don't mean to be. The Bible, I will admitt, is a bit confusing. I have trouble with it, too. Interpretation seriously comes... naturally to some, and not to others. It can be learned and improved upon if persued. But remember, your interpretation is not anyone else's interpretation. What makes your interpretation right, and not anyone else's? Say, "doctor" Kent Hovind -- who believes that the entire bible is fact, and none of it is figurative. Again, what dictates which is figurative and what isn't? There aren't any disclaimers before each section saying that something is figurative, or that something is literal. I don't see a problem here. How about when it sounds like it may have happened, it most likely did. If it sounds like just a story, it most likely is. Jews left egipt=yeah doesn't seem that creazy. Plus that's more like a fact as evidence points to it. Abraham talking to a burning bush=more like Abraham was smoking something. Jesus existed= would be hard to just make up a man that by all accounts was well known in a given region at this time. Plus he seems to be one of a number of profits from that time period, so existance of such person is not that creazy. Jesus walked on water= most likely made up by his fallowers
|
|
vichilux
Star
Hatsune Miku LALALALALA :D
Posts: 699
|
Post by vichilux on Dec 22, 2010 22:54:40 GMT -5
^That... kind of... no, yeah, ^that.
|
|
|
Post by nessieisreal on Dec 23, 2010 10:00:34 GMT -5
The way the Bible gets interpreted also depends on if the person reading it is a believer or not. Really, it takes actually reading the Bible a lot to see.
EDIT: There are small subtopics in certain Bibles that say, "The parable of...," "So-and-so interprets a dream," etc. This helps.
EDIT 2: My interpretation may be right, it may be wrong. Many scolars disagree, too. Dream interpretations, prophecies, and even parables are disagreed on. I'l go to church and disagree with my pastor or my youth leader. It makes for great discussion, actually. (I go to a diverse church.)
|
|
Flappy
Star
Grrr! But not really....
Posts: 577
|
Post by Flappy on Dec 23, 2010 15:48:47 GMT -5
In other words, if you're already a believer, you're more likely to believe something that is irrational and illogical, because you already believe something that is irrational and illogical. I'm sure there is a psychological bias which explains this effect.
Perhaps Irrational Escalation: the phenomenon where people justify increased investment in a decision, based on the cumulative prior investment, despite new evidence suggesting that the decision was probably wrong. (Probably not the best example, but it can definitely be applied)
|
|
|
Post by nessieisreal on Dec 23, 2010 16:04:10 GMT -5
Or, we have the ability to understand.
EDIT: It's called faith. I have faith in this.
|
|
|
Post by krzych32 on Dec 23, 2010 16:59:44 GMT -5
Or, we have the ability to understand. EDIT: It's called faith. I have faith in this. This reminds me of my speech class where I had two hard core Christian girls and when we ended up talking about evolution and stuff they started BSing about creationism and giving their highly irrational facts. I was like WTF they are fucking stupid but I can't say that because of the whole fucked up freedom of religion BS. One of them said that dinosaurs died out because they didn't fit into on Noas (most likely not spelled like that) boat. And that was in college BTW.
|
|
Flappy
Star
Grrr! But not really....
Posts: 577
|
Post by Flappy on Dec 23, 2010 17:38:43 GMT -5
Or, we have the ability to understand. EDIT: It's called faith. I have faith in this. It's pointless arguing with you. You're arrogant. Arrogance is disgusting. You're disgusting.
|
|
|
Post by krzych32 on Dec 23, 2010 17:57:55 GMT -5
Or, we have the ability to understand. EDIT: It's called faith. I have faith in this. It's pointless arguing with you. You're arrogant. Arrogance is disgusting. You're disgusting. That was uncalled for......
|
|
|
Post by Lyserg Zeroz on Dec 23, 2010 18:02:49 GMT -5
Faith is the thing to use when you really want to believe something but can't logically do it. Faith is not an ablity. Faith is not a gift from God. Faith is failing to your rational abilities and changing them for your desires. Faith is magic. Faith is alright sometimes I guess. But not now. The thing you said now it's pretty much like this: The bible should make a clear distinction between literal and figurative, because in a book where people revive, and walk on water, god knows what is true and with is figurative (ha, see what I did there ). Do not start to claim that some kind of magical ability is required to understand the bible (and yes, what you said is like saying that). Faith will not make you understand it any better, it will only make you more blind to whatever mistakes your faith may be presenting, it will make you more bias to believe anything that supports your faith. It's OK if you have faith in the bible, if you are a christian, then I suppose you should, but that doesn't make your beliefs any more right or wrong, it just makes you more reluctant to question them. BTW, there are a lot of believers who do question the bible, is not some kind of treason to your faith to do that. At this point I don't care if we get to "agree to disagree"...
|
|