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Post by UnfairBear on Mar 26, 2010 3:41:40 GMT -5
I thought I'd pull a fibre off the Religion thread.. well, nobody seemed to be discussing this so yeah *poll*.
Religion is taught in shcools in many different ways around the world. Some encourage free thought and the challenging of holy doctrines, and some aim to teach the benefits of a single faith. Some lucky children can choose whether or not to attend these classes but there ae also those who aren't.
How is Religion taught in schools your country?
How do you think it should be taught, if at all?
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Post by Johncoyne on Mar 26, 2010 5:30:02 GMT -5
I attended Catholic school for 7 years of my life. I recently transferred to public school. I really like when religion is taught in school.
In my school, religion isn't touched on much at all. People really don't react to religion like they should. In social studies, we're reading Night. I shows a bit of religion, but not much. I think that religion is one of the most important parts of history and our society.
In Catholic School, we learned about a lot about religion. We learned about the Catholic faith, Judaism, and whatever else my teacher thought we should know. It was great. Even though it was CATHOLIC school, we had a passover meal, and learned about religion, regardless of which faith it was.
I think that a lot of it has to do with people who can't keep their mouths shut. I'm not going to target groups in particular, but there are some things that can't be done at schools because of their inability to shut their mouths. Some people have a problem with holiday decorations. I have a problem with them. Look: if someone puts a Menorah somewhere, I wouldn't be offended, and I'm a strong Catholic. There are certain groups that can't can't cope with decorations. If they can't cope with decorations, classes are out of the question.
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Post by hey light on Mar 26, 2010 6:38:57 GMT -5
No, it isn't. And since the government has that whole seperation of church and state thing that people seem to need to be constantly reminded of these days, and that's in the constitution, and the constitution is read to apply to the states, then you can't teach about any religion, in public schools at least.
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Post by phlegmem on Mar 26, 2010 6:46:58 GMT -5
It's not taught here, but I feel it should be. Religions that practice differently and hold alternate beliefs to others should be taught, so that we can get a wider scope on humanity and all things connected to religion, which is a lot.
I'm in the last year of high school, and pupils in my classes are getting increasingly interested in religion. By the time you get to my age and haven't had any classes focused on that, it's up to the individual to research the religions that interest them. I used to live somewhere that did have a Bible studies and a general religion lesson. This puts me at a significant advantage when it comes to subjects like Art History, because religion is assimilated into that so much, it's unavoidable.
There's not an overwhelming belief or religion that is held nationwide in my country, so I think public schools could benefit from having at least one lesson on religion a week.
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Post by Ricky on Mar 26, 2010 7:05:01 GMT -5
No it is not taught in my school, I don't think it should be. People tend to speak too highly of their religions and belittle others
if a teacher was teaching me about his and I started questioning it (which is something you should be able to do on any subject at school) consequences would be unfair.
Also if its something you want to learn about as a philosophical pursuit you can do it in College, but highschools and lower should stick with the basics specially when children are so impressionable.
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bleabot
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Post by bleabot on Mar 26, 2010 7:15:11 GMT -5
No, it isn't. And since the government has that whole seperation of church and state thing that people seem to need to be constantly reminded of these days, and that's in the constitution, and the constitution is read to apply to the states, then you can't teach about any religion, in public schools at least. Separation of church and state means only one thing: the government can't say "Christianity is now the official religion of this country/state". It has to treat all religions equally. That's all it means. I believe religion should be taught, but not as a way to convert people. I want the theology of most major religions taught. People tend to not take religion seriously, but that's a huge problem. It's obviously a big deal if people are blowing themselves up for it. If we want to make a difference in the grand scheme of things, we need to understand religion, even if we're not religious. We need to know where 80% of the world is coming from (I read somewhere that 15%-20% of the world is atheist or agnostic). So yes, it should be taught in schools for understanding, nothing more.
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Post by UnfairBear on Mar 26, 2010 10:31:31 GMT -5
I agree with everyone who says it should be taught, and that we should get a well rounded education of all the major religions. But I think it should be mroe than that. I think kids should be taught about the actual concept of religion, of belief and faith. No matter who you are religion is an important part of who you are, whether you have it or have none at all. This sorta ties in with Dan's zombies idea. I think we should be taught not to be zombies about religion, to learn to question and analyse our own beliefs as well as others', and discern what it means to us.
Also I think kids whos parents impose their beliefs on them would benefit, because if they aren't taught about other ways in school then nobody is going to teach them. Sure it's great if they start to question things themselves but some people need that extra push, and that's okay. They should have it.
There'd probably have to be really well trained specialised teachers to teach it properly but I think it'd be totally worth it to have a generation of more free thinking individuals.
Here in Ireland it's up to the school whether or not to teach Religion in schools. We have 2 state exams here, the Junior Cert in 3rd year (9th grade) and the Leaving Cert in 6th year (12th grade). Mostly the schools decide what exams you take apart from electives. In my first school (which was a private multi-denominational Protestant school) we had religion class every year. In 1st and 2nd year pretty much all we learned about was Christianity (which really pissed me off) and we had yearly exams in it. They didn't make us do it for the Junior Cert though, or the Leaving Cert. I moved to a different school half way through 4th year, to a public Catholic school which accepted all denominations. They had had to do religion for the Junior Cert, but we didn't have to do it for the Leaving Cert. We had religion classes but no exams, and the discussion was more about morality and ethics etc than about religion. So yeah, it varies pretty widely throughout schools here.
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Post by RandiKthxxx on Mar 26, 2010 13:47:41 GMT -5
It's not necessarily taught but we touched on it briefly in history last year. "This is ______. This is what they believe. Know the difference."
It wasn't in depth at all. It wasn't to try to get us to convert it was just apart of the curriculum.
My Sociology teacher made a point that ,being a Christian, she did not believe in the theory of evolution, but as part of a class she had to take she had to know it. So she just asked "What do you want me to write on the test?" Because though she did not believe it, she still knew she had to know it for her test.
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Nakor
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Post by Nakor on Mar 26, 2010 13:57:09 GMT -5
Ugh, a teacher rejecting evolution? That's just sad, even if she wasn't teaching sciences. How do you end up in a teaching career while rejecting things that science has learned just because your religion says so? That's the kind of thing we need kept out of our schools. Be religious all you want but leave your false beliefs about science at the door.
Anyway.
I guess I can see my way around religion being taught in schools as long as:
1) As many major religions as possible are taught. Christianity, Judaism, Muslim, Buddhism, Hinduism, etc. 2) Also, atheism/agnosticism should be taught. Fair's fair. 3) It should not, under any circumstances, enter into any non-religious class except in purely factual ways. No intelligent design taught in science class, for example. (History classes would of course continue to include things religions have done that we know to be true.) 4) It should be a elective only. No mandatory religion classes. 5) As much as possible it should be taught by a neutral party. Not a Christian teaching the Christian bit and a Jew teaching the Judaism bit and so forth. One teacher who has knowledge of all of the above, and who won't be trying to pressure students one way or the other. (It's probably also cheaper that way.) 6) Speaking of which, schools had best only go looking for religion teachers if they have nothing better to spend their coin on. If class sizes in other studies are too big, best give those priority. Religion should be very low on the totem pole compared to sciences, social studies, maths, etc.
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Post by Lex on Mar 26, 2010 14:01:27 GMT -5
Here's something to point out: www.huffingtonpost.com/jeff-schneider/an-open-letter-to-the-tex_b_497695.htmlKeep religion out of schools period. If they want religion, they can go to their own little outside functions at churches, mosques, synagogues or what have you. School is for facts, and theories based upon facts only. Religion should stay out. I don't care if someone says "it's not that bad, and I think it's fun, so it should stay the way it is", because it creates such a slippery slope for the biased educators, especially Republican wingnuts.
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Nakor
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Post by Nakor on Mar 26, 2010 14:07:20 GMT -5
^ That's what I was going to come in to say, to be honest. In the end I decided that a totally neutral class that showed everything including atheism wasn't a terrible thing, though I doubt you'd get many kids in it, subject to the stipulations in my post.
As for rewriting text books, that seems to be a political problem more than a religious one at the moment. There needs to be a way of vetting what the politicians try to stick in the history books. Perhaps a vetting process performed by the teachers of the subject in question.
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Post by RandiKthxxx on Mar 26, 2010 14:34:45 GMT -5
Ugh, a teacher rejecting evolution? That's just sad, even if she wasn't teaching sciences. How do you end up in a teaching career while rejecting things that science has learned just because your religion says so? That's the kind of thing we need kept out of our schools. Be religious all you want but leave your false beliefs about science at the door. Lol it's a free country, she's allowed to believe what she wants. She wasn't preaching. She just made a simple statement. "I don't believe in evolution" There's nothing wrong with not believing in evolution. She was just making a point that we don't have to necessarily believe what we have to know in order to pass a class. So just like she doesn't have to believe in evolution, you don't have to believe the religion but if it's on the test, just know what to write down.
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Post by Johncoyne on Mar 26, 2010 14:48:59 GMT -5
Don't get me wrong, I don't think that schools should say, "This is the Body of Christ. Eat it and you shall have eternal life," schools should say, "Catholics believe that the eating the Eucharist, which they call the Body of Christ, will give them eternal life with their heavenly father. Now class, what do you think about that?" That would give healthy discussion about different religions. I know people that think that Jews don't praise God. I've heard people say, "Go praise your Jew God, you little Jew!" I can't stand that. Jews are fairly similar to Christians, but Jews don't believe in God (see below). They don't use the New Testament.
On a different note, I think that religious stories (Bible, Torah etc.) are great things to discuss in English class. Comparing the Noah's Ark to other flood stories is a great discussion.
EDIT!: Ok, HUGE MISTAKE THERE! I feel stupid. Thanks Alex, I wouldn't have noticed that. I meant to say Jews don't believe that Jesus died on the cross and rose from the dead to save our souls.
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Post by Lex on Mar 26, 2010 15:28:31 GMT -5
I know people that think that Jews don't praise God. I've heard people say, "Go praise your Jew God, you little Jew!" I can't stand that. Jews are fairly similar to Christians, but Jews don't believe in God. What planet are you from? Jews believe in God.
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Cortney
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Post by Cortney on Mar 26, 2010 15:38:31 GMT -5
I believe there could (and should) be an OPTIONAL theology class, where you could learn about different religions. Like an elective, really. That's about it.
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Nakor
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Post by Nakor on Mar 26, 2010 15:48:03 GMT -5
Ugh, a teacher rejecting evolution? That's just sad, even if she wasn't teaching sciences. How do you end up in a teaching career while rejecting things that science has learned just because your religion says so? That's the kind of thing we need kept out of our schools. Be religious all you want but leave your false beliefs about science at the door. Lol it's a free country, she's allowed to believe what she wants. She wasn't preaching. She just made a simple statement. "I don't believe in evolution" There's nothing wrong with not believing in evolution. She was just making a point that we don't have to necessarily believe what we have to know in order to pass a class. So just like she doesn't have to believe in evolution, you don't have to believe the religion but if it's on the test, just know what to write down. That's like saying "it's a free country so you're allowed to believe that the holocaust didn't happen." Sure, you can delude yourself if you want, but you're still an idiot for doing so. And when it's a teacher saying something like "I don't believe in the theory of evolution" my first reaction is "How intelligent can this teacher be?" and my second is "Should someone stupid enough to actually think that be teaching children?" I know that you can't take action against someone for just a statement like that (unless of course she was a science teacher and actually trying to teach students that evolution was a lie as though it were in the curriculum) but I expect my teachers to be generally intelligent people, and that comes into major question when they claim that they don't "believe in" what is a certain scientific fact.
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Cortney
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Post by Cortney on Mar 26, 2010 15:51:43 GMT -5
Separation of church and state means only one thing: the government can't say "Christianity is now the official religion of this country/state". It has to treat all religions equally. That's all it means. I beg to differ. Separation of church and state means that there cannot be a set religion for the country. It means that religion cannot influence laws and decisions made by the government. It means that religion cannot play a part in government-run systems (and yes, school is a government-run system). Pretty much, it means that religion is something that is personal and that you keep to yourself and those who agree with you. It's like being a vegetarian: you can have a club and you can avoid meat, but you can't change what everybody else eats.
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Post by Johncoyne on Mar 26, 2010 16:03:39 GMT -5
I know people that think that Jews don't praise God. I've heard people say, "Go praise your Jew God, you little Jew!" I can't stand that. Jews are fairly similar to Christians, but Jews don't believe in God. What planet are you from? Jews believe in God. AGH! I meant to say Jesus. Holy shirt. I thought I was making a good point, too. EDIT TIME. Thanks, Alex.
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Post by cmc413 (aka Chrissy) on Mar 26, 2010 16:42:52 GMT -5
I believe that people should be exposed to different world religions in public schools. However, this exposure should be limited to the following: - Learning about the main beliefs of world religions and how they influenced different cultures (The way that religions are taught in the AP World History curriculum is a great example of this. I learned so much about Islam, Hinduism, and Buddhism in that class.)
- Comparing the beliefs of one religion to another
- Reading and analyzing religious texts (Mythology, passages from the Bible and other holy texts, literature inspired by religion, etc.)
Religion education in public school should not endorse or undermine any (or all) religions. Teachers should not use these classes to convert students toward or away from religion. I also don't think that there should be separate religion classes, especially when schools are receiving less funding from the state, like in New York (yes, I'm looking at you Gov. Paterson). This religion education should take place supplemented with World History and English classes. Private schools, on the other hand, can do pretty much whatever they want to when it comes to religious education. They can teach their religious beliefs as facts, because that's what religious private schools were made for. The only thing is that they should teach students to accept the fact that many other people in the world have different beliefs than they do, and that these beliefs should be respected.
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Philosoraptor
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Post by Philosoraptor on Mar 26, 2010 16:50:10 GMT -5
Kids should be taught about modern religions just as much as they should be taught about defunct, ancient religions, in world history classrooms. We cover ancient Mayan mythology and ancient Greek mythology, among other things. This is the only place religion belongs in schools.
Private schools should not be allowed to purposefully teach children that myths are facts. That should be illegal.
There's nothing wrong with believing that the ancient Egyptians never really existed, either, but it's just a bit on the loony side.
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