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Post by sarahendipity on Mar 16, 2010 18:35:56 GMT -5
Before I start talking about my views on tribes, here is a story that I think needs to be told, as an example of how tribes can fail.
I'm currently vice-president of a club at my school called "Teens Organized Against Drugs and Substances," or TOADS for short. Since I'm a junior in high school and it has always been this tradition, I will automatically be president of said club next year as a senior. I've been looking forward to this basically since I was a freshman because I've just always enjoyed being in it, and it's just always felt like a tight knit "tribe." For several year, even though it seems more and more people are not showing up to meetings, we all seem to connect well.
However, this year has been much different. I don't want to go too deep into the nitty gritty details of what happened, but the current president has basically turned the club into a dictatorship. Our main goal as a club is to encourage having fun without having to turn to alcohol or other drugs. This girl has somehow twisted this goal into something along the lines of "People who do drugs are horrible people, we have to stop all of this nonsense now!" Now, I agree to some extent that drugs ARE bad, but I try not to judge someone if they have chosen the path of drugs. It's their own choice (not always the right one, but still their choice), and there is no one who can stop them except their own will-power.
There has been far worse incidences with this girl, such as ordering me to contact certain people as a Prom Week speaker, and then blowing me off just as I call the people that we are doing some else for Prom Week instead. The entire situation is a complete nightmare.
I went off a little too much about that. My point is that the club, or "tribe," has been turned around completely and is an absolute horrible example of tribal leadership. When a tribe is at the point of total collapse, and only the ignorant people who do not fully realize that there is a problem and the tribal leaders are the only ones still holding on for dear life, a huge recipe for disaster can occur. Sometimes certain people are just not made to be tribal leaders. I'm not even saying that Dan is a bad tribal leader, in fact is one of the best I've ever seen, but we just need to be aware that there ARE bad tribal leaders out there.
So I think that should be the end of my rant. If anyone has anything else to add to this discussion, please feel free to reply to this thread.
-Sarah
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Post by Joey on Mar 16, 2010 20:35:36 GMT -5
Yea my student council is very fun and we all like each other, but a girl whose sister was president last year and whos mom has been the adult rep. for about 7 thinks she runs it. And whenever me or my fellow council members suggest an idea the mom is like "Yea that sounds fun but last year..." or "wouldnt that be expensive" GOSH DANG IT WOMAN!!!!!!! IM THE FLIPPIN TREASURER AND WE WOULD HAVE ENOGH MONEY EVEN IF WE TRIED TO WASTE IT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Sorry, Ive been needing a rant for a while.
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Post by lizvallish on Mar 16, 2010 20:35:44 GMT -5
So, pretty much, when someone's given a title, they need to stick to it? I've worked with a nice version of the girl you're talking about. The guy did EVERYONE's job and left nothing for anyone else to do. Sure, he made everything the way he wanted but in the end it was HIS group instead of OUR group.
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Post by zAkAtAk on Mar 16, 2010 20:36:23 GMT -5
the KKK was such a good tribe.
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Post by sarahendipity on Mar 16, 2010 20:52:54 GMT -5
So, pretty much, when someone's given a title, they need to stick to it? I've worked with a nice version of the girl you're talking about. The guy did EVERYONE's job and left nothing for anyone else to do. Sure, he made everything the way he wanted but in the end it was HIS group instead of OUR group. First of all, LIZ??!?! Why did I not know you were on The Moon?  This is awesome. Second, yes, I've dealt with people like that as well. They are not as bad to deal with, but it's still incredibly frustrating. xD |
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Sammi
Moon
Are you wearing space pants?
Posts: 220
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Post by Sammi on Mar 17, 2010 16:39:03 GMT -5
Bad examples: Most internet forums... there is so much flaming that goes on on the interwebz  |
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Post by fredrik on Mar 17, 2010 16:45:47 GMT -5
Bad examples: Most internet forums... there is so much flaming that goes on on the interwebz But this one is an exception, right? |
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Post by Johncoyne on Mar 17, 2010 17:06:17 GMT -5
the KKK was such a good tribe. Wha?!? |
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Post by Ninjakirby on Mar 17, 2010 18:47:09 GMT -5
Yeah, I had something familiar happen as well, I am in a very awesome club called Youth In Government(It is more awesome than it sounds trust me). I had been in it for only two years(counting this one) and I heard it used to be more than twice as large just like 3 years ago. It is an amazing club and I had been one of the officers. I got to see our president work with the club and also I was there for the discussions at the officer meetings. I saw that our president did not have passion for the program, he seemed like a pretty good leader and he pretty much knew what he should do. But I don't think he went the extra mile for the club. Though our Vice President has unquestionable love for the program and our president feels that she would not be a fitting leader. I do know personally know how she would have been as president, but I feel she would have personally done as much as possible for the program.
Which brings a question to mind.
Which is better, a leader who is very passionate about what they are involved with or a leader who has a better understanding of leadership?
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Post by sarahendipity on Mar 17, 2010 20:43:45 GMT -5
Yeah, I had something familiar happen as well, I am in a very awesome club called Youth In Government(It is more awesome than it sounds trust me). I had been in it for only two years(counting this one) and I heard it used to be more than twice as large just like 3 years ago. It is an amazing club and I had been one of the officers. I got to see our president work with the club and also I was there for the discussions at the officer meetings. I saw that our president did not have passion for the program, he seemed like a pretty good leader and he pretty much knew what he should do. But I don't think he went the extra mile for the club. Though our Vice President has unquestionable love for the program and our president feels that she would not be a fitting leader. I do know personally know how she would have been as president, but I feel she would have personally done as much as possible for the program. Which brings a question to mind. Which is better, a leader who is very passionate about what they are involved with or a leader who has a better understanding of leadership? Haha, that doesn't sound nerdy at all! I've definitely heard of Youth In Government before, and it my school/ community had it, I would do it in a heart beat. As for your question, I think that a passionate leader is a better leader. I've found that the passionate leaders are the ones who tend to understand compassion and communication better than the ones who just know how to give directions and make decisions. There is more I would like to add about this topic, but right now, I have to finish up some homework and get ready for bed. I'll post more about this tomorrow. |
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Post by leviroseman on Mar 17, 2010 22:34:37 GMT -5
Bad examples: Most internet forums... there is so much flaming that goes on on the interwebz But this one is an exception, right? 100% exeption |
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Sammi
Moon
Are you wearing space pants?
Posts: 220
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Post by Sammi on Mar 17, 2010 22:43:48 GMT -5
But this one is an exception, right? 100% exeption Agreed. It is most definitely an exception  I really can't find anyone on here that doesn't get along... and everyone seems to be here for the right reasons |
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Post by UnfairBear on Mar 18, 2010 12:55:50 GMT -5
Which brings a question to mind. Which is better, a leader who is very passionate about what they are involved with or a leader who has a better understanding of leadership? It's great if a leader is passionate about what they're involved in, but if they have no leadership skills then the tribe is probably gonna fall flat on its face. In my college we have a Game Society, and considering we're an institute of technology it should be huge. But it's not, because the leader is god-awful. He loves games. However he doesn't love people. And he has no idea how they work, let alone how to lead them. Nobody WANTS to be lead by him, cuz he's a... well lets just leave it at that, I don't want half my post to turn in to swear words. In the end the only people who are really involved in the society are his friends, which is pointless and unfair on the rest of the people in the college who want to be part of a functioning society. That's just one situation, there's probably situations where a group would work better with a passionate leader with few leadership skills... But in the end I think a leader needs passion AND leadership skills to keep a tribe going. |
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Post by Ninjakirby on Mar 18, 2010 19:42:49 GMT -5
It's great if a leader is passionate about what they're involved in, but if they have no leadership skills then the tribe is probably gonna fall flat on its face. In my college we have a Game Society, and considering we're an institute of technology it should be huge. But it's not, because the leader is god-awful. He loves games. However he doesn't love people. And he has no idea how they work, let alone how to lead them. Nobody WANTS to be lead by him, cuz he's a... well lets just leave it at that, I don't want half my post to turn in to swear words. In the end the only people who are really involved in the society are his friends, which is pointless and unfair on the rest of the people in the college who want to be part of a functioning society. That's just one situation, there's probably situations where a group would work better with a passionate leader with few leadership skills... But in the end I think a leader needs passion AND leadership skills to keep a tribe going. Hm, it is interesting to see it the other way. I am sorry to hear that your Game Society club is not going well. Would you think the club will be able to keep going if he ends up learning some leadership skills? Also this is a question for everyone: Do you believe leadership is something that you are naturally born with or is it something that can be learned? |
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Post by Jake on Mar 19, 2010 2:34:55 GMT -5
Also this is a question for everyone: Do you believe leadership is something that you are naturally born with or is it something that can be learned? I reckon it's something you learn when you are fairly young - and it's not easy to change it either way, but still possible. |
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Post by UnfairBear on Mar 19, 2010 14:50:51 GMT -5
It's great if a leader is passionate about what they're involved in, but if they have no leadership skills then the tribe is probably gonna fall flat on its face. In my college we have a Game Society, and considering we're an institute of technology it should be huge. But it's not, because the leader is god-awful. He loves games. However he doesn't love people. And he has no idea how they work, let alone how to lead them. Nobody WANTS to be lead by him, cuz he's a... well lets just leave it at that, I don't want half my post to turn in to swear words. In the end the only people who are really involved in the society are his friends, which is pointless and unfair on the rest of the people in the college who want to be part of a functioning society. That's just one situation, there's probably situations where a group would work better with a passionate leader with few leadership skills... But in the end I think a leader needs passion AND leadership skills to keep a tribe going. Hm, it is interesting to see it the other way. I am sorry to hear that your Game Society club is not going well. Would you think the club will be able to keep going if he ends up learning some leadership skills? Also this is a question for everyone: Do you believe leadership is something that you are naturally born with or is it something that can be learned? Well, no because he's a total jerk, and to learn leadership skills he'd have to, y'know.. not be a jerk =P. I dunno, I guess if he wasn't a jerk he'd probably be a good leader. He could have the skills but, as I said, nobody wants to follow him. But he won't be in charge next year cause it's his last year so hopefully someone better will take over.. As for your other question, I think it's even more complicated than that. Like, leadership skills can surface in someone depending on a situation. So they might have no skills at one point and then another time suddenly can lead really well. Most of the time I tend not to lead, and people tend not to listen to me (well, they used not to, it's kinda different now), but if I'm in a group doing a project or something and nobody immediately takes control I start leading the group. And I think I do it pretty well. But I never learned leadership skills and I wouldn't say I was born with them because I don't always HAVE them. That said I think some people are natural born leaders and some learn the skills. People who were born leaders are probably better leaders in general though. |
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Post by sarahendipity on Mar 22, 2010 14:39:40 GMT -5
Great speculations guys!
Based on what everyone has been saying, it just goes to show that a good tribal leader not only needs to know how to BE a leader, but they also need to passionate.
If I had to chose between just be either having excellent leadership skills or being passionate, I think I would rather have passion. I find that I can connect with someone who is just passionate rather than knowing how to lead. Plus, like someone said above, people usually can figure out how to lead pretty quickly when forced into a situation where they need to be in charge. Humans might have natural leadership skills, but having that spark of passion does not always come.
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algo93
Meteorite
"History will be kind to me, for I intend to write it"
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Post by algo93 on Mar 22, 2010 22:35:35 GMT -5
the KKK was such a good tribe. Nathan Bedford Forrest is burning in hell right now. |
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Linus
Star
Life is complex; it has both real and imaginary components
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Post by Linus on Mar 23, 2010 8:08:09 GMT -5
Bad examples: Most internet forums... there is so much flaming that goes on on the interwebz 4chan |
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Post by durarara on Mar 24, 2010 22:57:55 GMT -5
Ok three things here.
One have you guys considered medical use of marijuana?(im not saying u guys are targeting weed specifically)
My friends has chrons disease and it helps him with the pain.
I myself suffer from anxiety and paranoia and i believe that a quick toke of marijuana often helps.(prescribed of course) By no means am I a pothead or addicted.I do it rarely when my problems get severe.
I am not saying that doing drugs is a good thing,of course it's not.But has your club ever discussed the potential medical marijuana has on our lives?
2.I agree with you against the whole "PEOPLE WHO DO DRUGS ARE BAD".
No they arent.Some are bad apples but the acquiantinces i have that do illicit drugs are usually decent,hardworking people.I know this sounds off but because one person does something wrong does not make them a bad person.
3.Your club leader has problems.Dictatorship is wrong...
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