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College
Mar 4, 2010 14:55:49 GMT -5
Post by Crabb90 on Mar 4, 2010 14:55:49 GMT -5
What are your thoughts on higher education? What do you think needs to change? Do you believe the United States needs education reform?
I believe higher education is necessary for except in some rare circumstances (like Dan Brown). However, educational institutions, even though they have embraced new technologies to certain extent, they haven't completely changed their method of teaching. Yes, they have computers and E-Mail and online services but, overall, they haven't really changed they strategy since the 1950s and if our education system doesn't reform soon, then we're going to see a lot more drop outs in the future.
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College
Mar 4, 2010 15:53:59 GMT -5
Post by zAkAtAk on Mar 4, 2010 15:53:59 GMT -5
Move to debate subforum please.
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College
Mar 4, 2010 16:12:39 GMT -5
Post by MattGilb3rt on Mar 4, 2010 16:12:39 GMT -5
Been there done that got the t-shirt Gona go back to do photography next time year! But it is over rated to a certain degree!
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College
Mar 4, 2010 20:03:16 GMT -5
Post by americanarchon on Mar 4, 2010 20:03:16 GMT -5
I'm just about to enter into college now. I'm somewhat excited, though it seems a bit daunting.
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College
Mar 4, 2010 20:28:40 GMT -5
Post by Danielle on Mar 4, 2010 20:28:40 GMT -5
We need a "I plan on attending in the future" option for youngsters.
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College
Mar 4, 2010 20:30:07 GMT -5
Post by americanarchon on Mar 4, 2010 20:30:07 GMT -5
I'm sure the applying option should be flexible enough to cover that
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College
Mar 4, 2010 22:33:09 GMT -5
Post by themarsrover on Mar 4, 2010 22:33:09 GMT -5
The Thing About College Is That Even Though I Might Not Get My Money's Worth In EDUCATION At College, I Still Get My Money's Worth. The Way I've Come To This Conclusion Is That JOBS CHECK RESUMES. When You Apply For A Job And It Says That You Went To Stanford, You'll Probably Be Getting That Job, EVEN IF, You Didn't Learn Much. And If You Dropped Out Of School You Probably WON"T Be Getting That Job, EVEN IF, You Learned More Than You Would've At Stanford. Basically What I'm Saying Is That I Am Going To College.[/b]
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College
Mar 4, 2010 22:38:13 GMT -5
Post by Danielle on Mar 4, 2010 22:38:13 GMT -5
OMG Stop capitalizing every word! Doesn't that waste time? It's so difficult to read!
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grover
Moon
whatever.
Posts: 203
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College
Mar 4, 2010 23:14:58 GMT -5
Post by grover on Mar 4, 2010 23:14:58 GMT -5
I think capitalizing is useful for emphasis, and is quicker than italics.
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Post by zAkAtAk on Mar 5, 2010 9:17:47 GMT -5
I dislike how liberal art colleges put so much emphasis on recieving a well rounded education. I am an MIS major (Management Information Systems, IT work) and I hate how my first two years of my education have been filling up requirements by the college. I have only taken 1 MIS course my entire two years of college so far. I understand the value of other classes, but forcing me to take courses that I am disinterested in is good for no one. Let me explain.
My college requires a foreign language. You have to take classes up to a class level of 213. If you have taken a foreign language in high school or in other previous education, you don't have to start at the 111 level (there is a total of 6 classes in total that are needed to fufill the requirement). If you are forcing me to go to a class for 2 years that I dispise, I am not going to want to learn the material. I will not be an active learner. I will hate it and will probably make it difficult for the proffessor who probably loves this material. I'm going to learn the material for the final exam. I'm going to take the final exam and then the second I am done, I am going to empty my brain of everything I didn't care for about the class, which in this case would be probably almost everything. I have not learned anything. You have only wasted my money, time, and you have probably ruined any interest in the matter. No good comes out of this.
Other than that, I see no real problem with the actual education part of education. I think that students are being screwed over by colleges with how much tuition is for 4 years. Tuition is far more expensive than it was 20 or 30 years ago, even considering inflation and the value of the dollar.
Finally, I would like to say the college is not for everyone. If you wish to persue something that does not require a college degree, then there really isn't a need. However, you are making yourself less marketable to an employer. If you have a certain skill set, and another person has the same skill set as you but has a college degree, almost 100% of the time the person with the degree will get the job. Those will college degrees tend to have higher pays, but they also have higher debt. They have to pay off students loans, and they also missed out of 4 years of full-time income. Statistically, those that have a bachelor's degree (4 year) have higher income during their lifetime than those who work straight out of high school.
I don't want to come off as, everyone should get a college education. I am certainly not saying that. College is not for some people. Some people have no idea what to do with their life and cliche right now is that when you're a senior in high school, you start to apply for college. No one knows what they want to do for the rest of their life when they are only 17 or 18. Some people go to college and it isn't for them. But not everyone can afford a college education. Perhaps you have a strong desire to go to college to persue a field but you do not have sufficient funds. You might be stuck doing something you dislike right out of high school for the rest of your life.
College needs to be less expensive so that way more people can "test-drive" what they might do for the next 40 or so years of their working life. People that drop out on a whim or because they have failed out piss me off. You were just given the ticket to being able to make a higher amount of income and you just denied it when there are plenty of other people that would give up their right hand to attend a 4 year university.
Due to my laziness and short attention span, I have decided not to read your lengthy post. "Required classes" are dumb and waste time. College is not for everyone. College needs to be less expensive.
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College
Mar 5, 2010 18:36:58 GMT -5
Post by Shaken Earth on Mar 5, 2010 18:36:58 GMT -5
What about the "I'm not old enough to go yet" choice?
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College
Mar 5, 2010 18:52:10 GMT -5
Post by swan on Mar 5, 2010 18:52:10 GMT -5
My guess as to why universities force you to take classes outside your major is incase you decide that you aren't really interested in your major and choose to switch majors, you haven't wasted your time at university. On the other hand, I suppose if you switch to a different major that doesn't directly use those required classes the time is wasted anyway, and the time is also wasted if you don't switch majors at all. I don't know
And I agree that tuition is too high
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College
Mar 5, 2010 19:18:13 GMT -5
Post by zAkAtAk on Mar 5, 2010 19:18:13 GMT -5
My guess as to why universities force you to take classes outside your major is incase you decide that you aren't really interested in your major and choose to switch majors, you haven't wasted your time at university. On the other hand, I suppose if you switch to a different major that doesn't directly use those required classes the time is wasted anyway, and the time is also wasted if you don't switch majors at all. I don't know If I want to look into new classes, I will take the intro class myself. The college is not my mother at the dinner table telling me to eat all the vegetables that we have to offer. At this point we are adults, we choose for ourselves. If we don't like what we are pursuing, then we can do this "exploratory" work on our own. No need to force it down our throats.
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College
Mar 5, 2010 19:26:49 GMT -5
Post by Danielle on Mar 5, 2010 19:26:49 GMT -5
Well, I go to an art school and I still have to take quite a few gen ed and liberal arts classes. I like having a lot of general knowledge, so I enjoy them. Outside of writing and public speaking, many of my friends hate that we have to take them. It's not like we can switch our major to Anthropology or Physics if we really want to, they're not available as majors. We can't even minor in them.
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College
Mar 5, 2010 20:13:30 GMT -5
Post by swan on Mar 5, 2010 20:13:30 GMT -5
If I want to look into new classes, I will take the intro class myself. The college is not my mother at the dinner table telling me to eat all the vegetables that we have to offer. At this point we are adults, we choose for ourselves. If we don't like what we are pursuing, then we can do this "exploratory" work on our own. No need to force it down our throats. Certainly, but I'm not necessarily defending it, I'm just trying to understand the reasoning behind it, because there should be some reasoning behind it. At my university the required courses can all be taken in the first year and no specific classes are required. I don't know how your university deals with the required courses, but I can at least take courses I find interesting even if I'll never use them. One class in two years is ridiculous and I can certainly understand you mean. As for your arts college Danielle, do they offer and/or require courses like Physics? If they do, I find it pretty odd that they would make a specific course a requirement when a student can't major in that course.
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College
Mar 5, 2010 20:53:23 GMT -5
Post by chelseeyuh on Mar 5, 2010 20:53:23 GMT -5
Today, college is the norm for what people "should" do after high school. Most jobs require a degree, so it's understandable, but it also means that people who don't go to college are ostracized. I think that in most cases, if you want a good job that requires brain power, you need a college degree. But then sometimes there's the exception-- those rare geniuses who can drop out of school and be successful. If a person wants to be self-employed, and they are driven, they can be successful without a college education. I saw an article on Yahoo yesterday in which this guy was arguing against going to college because there's so much debt, and even though you make more than a non college grad, when you factor in the cost of school, it really doesn't make a difference. But in this comparison, you're comparing two completely different types of jobs; those that require a college education will likely be more thoughtful jobs, whereas a job that doesn't require a degree will be a more manual labor sort of thing. So, if you have a specific career choice in mind, you shouldn't blow off college just because of the cost. Also, I know that the cost of college is high (and has actually increased tenfold in the past 30 years), but I don't think lack of money is such a viable excuse. If you get good grades in high school, you can get a college scholarship. My family isn't going to be contributing to paying for my college at all, but that doesn't deter me from wanting to go to a school that cost $40,000 or $50,000 per year. Why? Because I know that I'm going to get scholarships. Where there's a will there's a way. My will to get good grades and get into a good college is also providing a means by which to attend the school.
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Post by noobsensei on Mar 6, 2010 1:22:28 GMT -5
If you want to impact the world in any meaningful way, you'll need a college degree. Don't listen to Dan. While his videos are usually insightful, he's flat-out wrong on this and the point he made in his video was incoherent.
Not everyone is going to be a Bill Gates...even people who are every bit as smart as he is. To really change the world without a college degree, you need both intellect AND a huge amount of luck. I think that instead of looking to dropouts like Bill Gates as evidence that we don't need college, it's much better to look at the fact that there aren't a lot MORE people like Bill Gates as evidence that we do.
I realize that college isn't for everyone. If you don't aspire to change the world or have a professional career or make a lot of money, that's perfectly fine and maybe you don't need college. There are plenty of vocational schools that are a great fit for a lot of people. But please, for the love of God, don't say you aren't going to college because it will interfere with your education (that means you, Dan). I used that phrase a lot myself when I was an undergrad...usually as an excuse not to study.
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Post by Ryan on Mar 6, 2010 1:42:25 GMT -5
In regards to college, and even Dan Brown dropping out...
College is simply not for everybody. Dan is very fortunate in that his job does not require a college degree, and since Dan is insightful and has grand ideas, he may continue and go on to change the world doing what he does - the best of luck to him with that.
Many people find themselves in this situation: intelligent people who find themselves in a position where in fact a college degree is obsolete. My father was a college drop out and got into a field that he enjoyed and was very good at, and he currently makes three times more money than my mother. He was lucky. If someone today tried to get into his job without a college education - it would be impossible.
If you are not so lucky, and when it comes time to decide whether or not to go/stay in college, you should probably go/stay. After all, while you may learn useless facts and may have to pay through the teeth to learn said useless facts, you will also learn the valuable skill set that I think is rarely available outside college life. Interacting with those around you who are heading in a similar life path to you, learning how to apply facts to a situation that you will most likely face sometime during your career, and learning how to find facts that will help you solve the problems you face in life, are all examples of things you learn in college outside of facts.
Dan Brown was a lucky one, he found people that share an interest in him, he has the skills that he needs for his career, and he knows how to go about finding facts to solve the problems he faces in life. He found the college experience, outside of college. If you haven't found these experiences yet, then it would be strongly advised that you attend, so that you may come away with an education, perhaps not of facts, but of skills.
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Post by stubby42 on Mar 6, 2010 7:34:14 GMT -5
What? no option for graduated?
Man way to go make me feel old.
My expereince of university was a waste of time, I learnt very little and didnt make any useful contacts.
Thats not to say it higher education is a waste, its just I was un lucky, I picked the wrong school and got stuck with un motivated people and after a while that brings you down.
It was totally different when I studied in canada, it was an amazing experience and I learnt a lot. The only time I learnt anything in the uk was when I was writing my dissertation and I only learnt useful things because I picked the subject matter.
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College
Mar 6, 2010 21:34:28 GMT -5
Post by Danielle on Mar 6, 2010 21:34:28 GMT -5
As for your arts college Danielle, do they offer and/or require courses like Physics? If they do, I find it pretty odd that they would make a specific course a requirement when a student can't major in that course. I don't know if it's Physics specifically. Biology, yes. Anatomy and Physiology, yes. I know the architecture majors have to take Physics, for obvious reasons. We have to take quite a few literature classes, maths, sciences, TONS of history courses... However, I love these classes. They're fun. One thing that does bother me is that ALL majors have to take three semesters of drawing. We have film, photography, sound design, performing arts, etc. They still have to take drawing classes. The liberal arts classes are not very intense. They're laid back and fun. The drawing classes, however, are very competitive and intense because most of the people here are good at drawing.
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