Camoon
Star
[AWD:01020307]
Trust your pilot, respect your monkey.
Posts: 574
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Post by Camoon on Dec 5, 2010 19:06:40 GMT -5
I can't remember who said that, but I think this is of total relevance here. So it seems my post has become quite controversial. In this post I'd like to address a few of the points, raised by the two predominant mindsets, in these threads, including The Moon is Dying, The Final Project, and The Moon is not fucking dead. So essentially, there seem to be two predominant mindsets: - People who want to do something about it
- People who are content to not do anything
People who want to do something about itThese are the people who have been suggesting what we should do, coming up with ideas (controversial and not) to help get the tribe back on it's feet. People who don'tThese people like how the tribe is. They like that the members are declining and they don't want to do anything about it. They believe that smaller members equals a closer community. THE PROBLEM WITH THISTake a look at some of these quotes: I'm content with losing members because the members we're losing, quite frankly, suck. I like The Moon a looooooooooot more now than I did 4 months ago. I don't know if you were around 4 months ago, but this place was incredibly unpleasant. The drama was absolutely 100% non-stop, there was always bickering, always people spreading rumors, a stupid obsession over Dan, stupid trolls, and just plain disaster. First off, this is completely stupid. Of course there are going to be trolls, it comes with the package of lots of members, and surely that's what YOU (an admin) signed up to tackle? In your words "If you can't handle the suckage, get the fuck out of the bedroom." Bree, I'm siding with you. This place is great. Even if we have a little bit of a problem with inactivity, we can push through. BTW, Camoon, I haven't know you well over the last few months, but I have lost respect every thread of respect to you and anyone who agrees with you. We can push through... by doing what? Sitting back and pretending it's not happening? Let's DO SOMETHING!I like this observation. First off because it makes me look good xD Secondly, because it defines the difference between our two mindsets and suggests the destructive nature of the the mindset of the person who is content with how things are. I think that's the difference between us and and Bree's side. Bree, for the last 3 months you've been content to let the moon lose members. Every time someone brings up this discussion you cut it down, without meeting the OP halfway, saying we could actually try to do something. This post shows that the side of PROGRESS is much more likely to come to a compromise. INACTION IS DESTROYING THE MOONYou realize you're destroying The Moon with this, right? You're making it so, so, so, so much worse. Just go away. Because telling members to go away is a much better way of getting more members. WHICH ARE YOUI'd like you to take this message, and think about which kind of person you would like to be: that which is content to adapt to the world, or that which adapts the world to ourselves. One last thing: I'm sorry if you think my post was destructive, but take another look at it more closely; so far it's been a pretty effective shock tactic to get things done.  |
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Post by bombmaniac on Dec 5, 2010 19:24:26 GMT -5
Stagnation is unacceptable. And I would like to point out that the drama four months ago was cause by the same sentiment being expressed as in the aforementioned threads. People got frustrated when Dan was leaving and the realization that we have not accomplished what we set out to do led to an intense feeling of negativity.
Since that time very little has been made in actual progress. I know, Bree, you would like to contend that we need to build a stronger community before we can attempt to "change the world" but here are two obvious flaws in your argument.
A) Your approach as thus far failed miserably as evidenced by the general feeling of the forum for the past few months.
B) What makes you think that the two are mutually exclusive? Why are you so convinced that community building cannot be an outgrowth, an added benefit if you will of improving the world? Is it not logical to think that as a forum like ours collaborates and unites under a common purpose, working on a project together to help others would build teh community, and strengthen our ties with each other?
I've heard you say countless times that there is too much discord to get anything done, perhaps look in the mirror? Every time something new and ambitious is proposed you are the first to say it is unnecessary, and look where we are now. A forum of disgruntled members who want to move forward.
It would be unfair to pin the blame solely on you, however many times you are the primary force behind dissent. So i must ask you, what is your problem? What is it to you if the rest of us would like to actually accomplish something? You constantly say we aren't ready, at what point in your oh so mighty opinion will we be ready?
So we argue at times, so we have drama, which healthy community doesn't? We should power through it, pursue our goals, reach for the stars regardless of the opposition, and regardless of the difficulty. Rome wasn't built in a day, and neither will a world be changed in a day, but each step counts. No matter how minute, each little project is a brick in the building of a great edifice.
Instead of putting the damper of Cameron's (et al) drive for change, harness it. Instead of deciding that his idea is not to your liking and therefore dismissing the drive behind it, reshape it and use it to move forward. Ideas have been proposed that are radical, because people are desperate for progress and growth. Please don't destroy that drive, don't dampen the spirit, help it along.
Once again. You may be content with where we are, and you may be content with indefinite stagnation, but if the general consensus is against you then you should do what is best for the tribe as a whole and go with it. As an admin you are tasked with acting in our interests. Please do so.
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Post by Alex on Dec 5, 2010 19:56:43 GMT -5
I don't see a point in working towards this "greater good" if it puts too much stress on us as a tribe. Most of the projects we do don't help us grow out. If we really want to grow as a tribe, doing real life projects won't get us there. We need to somehow alert people on the internet that can just click a link and sign up.
If we spent 1 hour advertising this forum on the internet, we would gain 5 members in that hour, and then it would continue for a week before this advertising died out. If you did the same thing in real life, we would probably gain 2 members, then no one else would know. It is by far easier to just not give a damn about real life.
Now back to the main point. I want to gain members. I really do. But, if this begins to interfere with the fun that we are having, then it will probably have the reverse effect. What we really need to do is advertise this place not as a place that changes the world, but as a fun getaway where friends are plentiful. We can then have fun while advertising, keep our current members, get new ones, and maybe even get old ones back.
We have around 60 active members. There are around 4,760 total. 1.26% of our members are active. Have you ever thought people aren't joining because of these tiny numbers? It's because our constant unhappy mood is driving people away. How can we change this?
Be happy. Have fun. Don't worry about real life projects or noble causes. Don't even worry about projects that grow us out unless you truly are dedicated to that. Do things that you have fun doing, and more members will be attracted to this place.
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Post by bombmaniac on Dec 5, 2010 19:59:43 GMT -5
all that gets in the way of our happiness are people insisting that progress is bad. just because one member doesnt like progress does NOT mean that we have to cave because that member likes kicking up a stink!
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Post by Alex on Dec 5, 2010 20:01:02 GMT -5
I am NOT opposed to your decisions. I just will not be a leader, or even a helper. I wouldn't "kick up a stink". I'll just have fun in my sandbox.
EDIT: I MEANT WOULDN'T
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Post by bombmaniac on Dec 5, 2010 20:02:48 GMT -5
you know what its like? its like giving in to a little kid who throws a tantrum just to avoid the mess.
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Post by Alex on Dec 5, 2010 20:06:34 GMT -5
Yes, it is. You guys should never give in. If someone is posing a threat to the integrity of the forums, talk to them and warn them. If they keep it up, isolate and remove the problem.
If it happens to be an admin... Impeach them.
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Camoon
Star
[AWD:01020307]
Trust your pilot, respect your monkey.
Posts: 574
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Post by Camoon on Dec 5, 2010 20:07:21 GMT -5
WOO!
Oh crap...
Bullshit. How will it interfere with the fun we're having? It was so much more fun when it was active.
Hmm... How about we advertise it as a place where we become friends and have fun improving the world?
No, it's because Dan pushed the tribe to begin with, so it had tons of members. And with no reinforcement advertising now and then, it can only decline.
You do that if you want. Just don't get in the way of me being pro-active about getting new members.
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Post by Alex on Dec 5, 2010 20:10:46 GMT -5
MOMENT OF REALIZATION:
It is not the act of getting new members that may pose a threat to this forum. It is the party poopers.
My argument is invalid.
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Post by Lyserg Zeroz on Dec 5, 2010 20:24:57 GMT -5
About the last quote on the OP:
?? But she said that because you were telling members to go away 0.0, which, if it happened, would have in fact "destroyed the moon" (or make it to be absorbed by other place)
I think this thread is an awful way of labeling members of the pogotribe and separating them. And it's making it look like Bree doesn't want projects being done and is opposed to everything that can get the moon doing someting, which I don't think it's truth. I think she just likes the moon (or doesn't feel extreme hate and pessimism for how it is now), ergo, she doesn't think "this place sucks and everything here is bullshit! AHRG!", which is kinda the approach that some people take when deciding to do stuff. And liking the moon (not thinking it sucks) has nothing to do with not wanting to move forward and do something.
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Post by SwimFellow on Dec 5, 2010 20:25:31 GMT -5
Excuse me? I said we could push through. I didn't say that we were right now. I think that we should be. Camoon, I now have negative respect for you.
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Post by qooqǝɯɐƃ on Dec 5, 2010 21:18:27 GMT -5
It feels like the people who want to do something about the state of the moon are more concerned with doing projects and reducing "worldsuck". While the others seem to just want the moon to be a forum.
It's quality over quantity. If we do IRL projects the people we gain would be a lot more committed than the people we get from advertisements, not to mention cheaper.
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vichilux
Star
Hatsune Miku LALALALALA :D
Posts: 699
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Post by vichilux on Dec 6, 2010 16:21:22 GMT -5
So essentially, there seem to be two predominant mindsets: - People who want to do something about it
- People who are content to not do anything
People who want to do something about itThese are the people who have been suggesting what we should do, coming up with ideas (controversial and not) to help get the tribe back on it's feet. People who don'tThese people like how the tribe is. They like that the members are declining and they don't want to do anything about it. They believe that smaller members equals a closer community. I have to disagree... Some think the moon is dead, some think it isn't... but as I said, idk, somewhere else: We all want to make the moon a better place... right? even if we think is not dead, I'm sure everyone wants that. So yeah, I don't really get why to take sides. You guys (all of us) (yeah, even me) are being dramatic. The "progressists" have good ideas to "revive the moon" and the "contents" have good ideas to "improve" it... So yeah, just stop fighting, for god sakes... ._. (<- not-angry-but-serious face) |
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Camoon
Star
[AWD:01020307]
Trust your pilot, respect your monkey.
Posts: 574
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Post by Camoon on Dec 6, 2010 17:24:43 GMT -5
So essentially, there seem to be two predominant mindsets: - People who want to do something about it
- People who are content to not do anything
People who want to do something about itThese are the people who have been suggesting what we should do, coming up with ideas (controversial and not) to help get the tribe back on it's feet. People who don'tThese people like how the tribe is. They like that the members are declining and they don't want to do anything about it. They believe that smaller members equals a closer community. I have to disagree... Some think the moon is dead, some think it isn't... but as I said, idk, somewhere else: We all want to make the moon a better place... right? even if we think is not dead, I'm sure everyone wants that. So yeah, I don't really get why to take sides. You guys (all of us) (yeah, even me) are being dramatic. The "progressists" have good ideas to "revive the moon" and the "contents" have good ideas to "improve" it... So yeah, just stop fighting, for god sakes... ._. (<- not-angry-but-serious face) My point is, some people don't want the moon to grow. This thread is calling those people out. It's all irrelevant now anyway because... well it's a long story, and there are personal feelings involved. |
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Post by Insane_Zang on Dec 6, 2010 18:00:07 GMT -5
Locked for not being... needed? Yeah, not needed anymore. K
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