Gesh
Planet
Mishap Molly Cordell
Posts: 453
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Post by Gesh on Apr 5, 2010 14:27:43 GMT -5
I don't think that is a fact, unless Dan starts going a different direction than the Tribe, there would be no problem in my opinion. Of course blindly following a person is bad, but having someone to lead is not, as it generates a lot more productivity and structure. At least that's my view on it I completely agree with this; I see no reason to break away from Dan unless he starts pulling us in a different direction than what our values state. It's kind of sort of like the idea of a right to rebel that John Locke came up with. If the government fails to do what it is obligated to (protect the natural rights of the citizens), then the citizens have a right to overthrow or alter the government. In this case, the natural rights in the equation would be our established values. If Dan falls away from what we have established as our values, then we should overthrow or alter the tribal leadership. But unless that happens, Dan should definitely remain leader, because he has a good standing in the public and has "connections," so he can really get us somewhere. Plus, he's just flat-out a good leader! He's doing an awesome job.
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revolution689
Meteorite
If you're reading this, you just lost the game!!!
Posts: 36
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Post by revolution689 on Apr 5, 2010 16:04:34 GMT -5
We are not ready to be independent from Dan. When we are ready, it shall be.
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Gesh
Planet
Mishap Molly Cordell
Posts: 453
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Post by Gesh on Apr 5, 2010 19:17:09 GMT -5
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Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
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Post by Deleted on Apr 6, 2010 4:55:09 GMT -5
I don't think that is a fact, unless Dan starts going a different direction than the Tribe, there would be no problem in my opinion. Of course blindly following a person is bad, but having someone to lead is not, as it generates a lot more productivity and structure. At least that's my view on it I completely agree with this; I see no reason to break away from Dan unless he starts pulling us in a different direction than what our values state. It's kind of sort of like the idea of a right to rebel that John Locke came up with. If the government fails to do what it is obligated to (protect the natural rights of the citizens), then the citizens have a right to overthrow or alter the government. In this case, the natural rights in the equation would be our established values. If Dan falls away from what we have established as our values, then we should overthrow or alter the tribal leadership. But unless that happens, Dan should definitely remain leader, because he has a good standing in the public and has "connections," so he can really get us somewhere. Plus, he's just flat-out a good leader! He's doing an awesome job. The same principle has existed for centuries in Confucianism (I'm just saying, China beats England XD), where he said that "the ruler of the country is the person closest to the gods, and chosen by the gods to rule the country. Since the gods are perfect, so is that person. However, if after a long line of perfect rulers, a non-perfect ruler ascends to the throne, that means that men made a mistake and that he shouldn't be in power. Thus it's the task of the people to overthrow that bad person and by doing that the new leader will automatically arise and begin another dynasty of good rulers until the next bad one comes along." He also says that "as long as the ruler is a good person, the people need to follow him, as it will lead to prosperity." There you go, some Asian knowledge by a European kid ftw!
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Gesh
Planet
Mishap Molly Cordell
Posts: 453
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Post by Gesh on Apr 6, 2010 13:51:31 GMT -5
Yes, that much is true. If there is a good person/leader on the throne, acting somewhat as an absolute monarch, then that is a good thing. That person will lead the country to great things, even if the majority disagrees on it, it will actually turn out better for the country in the end. The only problem is, someone as kind-hearted, knowledgeable, and modest as that so that they will not become corrupted by power, would probably not even come to power in the first place, as they are not power-hungry.
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Deleted
Deleted Member
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Post by Deleted on Apr 6, 2010 14:12:44 GMT -5
they would if they are motivated for a good cause..
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Gesh
Planet
Mishap Molly Cordell
Posts: 453
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Post by Gesh on Apr 6, 2010 16:23:08 GMT -5
Well, speaking for myself... I'm not saying I'm really super kind-hearted and knowledgeable and modest and all that, but I do at least try to be, and if I were in that situation, personally I know I would probably not want to take a leadership role, regardless of my motivation. I would probably vote for someone who I knew had the same values I did. But that's just me anyway. Though, again, I'm likely not fully the kind of person I described in my previous post.
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Post by thejourney on Apr 6, 2010 17:02:53 GMT -5
Here, I made us a banner for the new site! Why the balloon?! you question the balloon why did you not notice the giant cookie cool banner though
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Post by thejourney on Apr 6, 2010 17:51:02 GMT -5
i dont realy see dan as a leader a see every one of us as a leader we must all lead the tribe in the direction to stage 5 by doing things to make our own world better and the world around us dan is more like a recruiter to me
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conrad141
Meteorite
I am less than three lomography.
Posts: 16
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Post by conrad141 on Apr 6, 2010 19:48:05 GMT -5
I always thought we should be called moontribe since it kinda makes more sense... and we won't be instantly associated with Pogo sticks whenever someone hears our name. Dan said he wants to get to a point where people will join the tribe without knowing who Dan Brown is... how is that possible when we're called Pogotribe?! It's not too late for a name change. Anyone else for Moontribe? America isn't called "Obamaland". xD Please remember that without dan we wouln't be here
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Deleted
Deleted Member
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Post by Deleted on Apr 7, 2010 6:35:10 GMT -5
Everyone here should watch this video on TED: www.ted.com/talks/derek_sivers_how_to_start_a_movement.htmlWhat this means, and what I mean, is that by starting this movement, Dan is our Tribe's leader. That doesn't mean that he's more important than any of us, just that he started. We, the ones following should acknowledge that, but also realize that we have the power that the tribe needs to exist. A tribe where everyone is a leader can't exist, because then you would have no one who follows and thus have no movement. (this was mainly thejourney) A name change would be a bad idea because then we'd have to re-define ourselves and that would probably lead to internal struggles. at least that's what I think.
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Post by Jake on Apr 7, 2010 15:36:00 GMT -5
We don't ride Pogosticks, why are we called Pogotribe?! (Okay, some of us ride pogosticks, but not many) Yes, but we also aren't living on the south pole of the moon, but that doesn't mean we should change the url! That's one of my favourite TED Videos! It's quick, to the point and also kinda funny!
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Post by mashuga31 on Apr 8, 2010 13:33:36 GMT -5
wow, this started a large discussion. I didn't necessarily mean that we should take Dan down from the pedestal as leader, though I do feel like there is a bigger picture rather than what Dan is telling us to do. We should take control of certain things while he guides others. All I mean to say is that we have our own ideas and everything and that we aren't really 'followers' of Dan Brown. Dan did start this all and we should always let him be there to guide us but in truth- some things like declaring 'independence' increase the positive mentality of the tribe as a whole. We aren't declaring that we want to be our own independent group aside from Dan Brown, but what we should do is declare that we are equal to Dan Brown. We are equal to his leadership and thus he is also a part of our community as a whole. Think of a cell. The organelles respond to the nucleus but the nucleus isn't "above" them. Without the organelles the nucleus is useless and vice-versa. The nucleus is surrounded by the rest of the cell and is in turn, a part of it. We shouldn't declare that we are independent from 'Dan' but should declare that we as a whole (including Dan) and an independent cell. Something entirely different from the Dan Brown others know on Youtube. We should not declare independence from Dan Brown the individual but from from the Dan Brown everyone else knows. This is not a fan club rather it is a whole new thing started 'by' Dan Brown. Hopefully that made sense
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RabbitWho
Star
Rebecca - How 'bout we all put or real names somewhere in our signatures or titles? [SKB:]
Posts: 808
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Post by RabbitWho on Apr 21, 2010 15:32:40 GMT -5
Questions for you guys: Do you think that having a single leader makes him a representative of us for the world? Do you think that the things he says and does directly reflect on our community? Do you think that because of this the community has some personal stake in what he says? - some investment, some right, or some vulnerability Do you think that this means he has given up some kind of personal liberty because he represents us? - Do you think he is answerable to us? If not do you think we give up something because we are associated as a tribe with every sentence he utters? Do you think that his decorum should reflect us? Or that we should reflect him? Do you think we should just ignore all this and have fun? Here is the post that got me thinking about it. I'M COMPLETELY SHOCKED!!!!!!!!! seriously, until I watch the Tea Party video I thought Dan was one of the most inteligent people on Earth, As I said in this post I wanted to create a Pogo Tribe site in spanish, I've already gathered the people and someone who puts the money. NOW I DON'T KNOW WHAT TO DO. I don't think this is a joke 'cuz I've just watched the gorila vid and he's in the same "state". He doesn't only look like a fool, but he brings down the whole Pogo Tribe reputation. Seriously, I don't know what to do with the project, and I'm sure the people from the project isn't happy either. Quote from a poster who seems dedicated to the community and who wanted/wants to create a Spanish wing. Danielle made a good point in another thread that she felt that "people" (as if people had one mind which changed) were angry at Dan for making serious videos and then later angry at him for making fun ones. But of course it was different people each time. So my conclusion is that he can't please everyone so he should just please himself. (Oh behave!) I think it's not really fair on Dan that every video he makes has the potential to affect the community. the only thing that can keep us together is our diversity and our acceptance of each other and everything, our acceptance that we are a complete mixed bag but we just share common goals and values. The very fact that no matter what any of us does one of us isn't going to like it. But this doesn't cancel out all the questions I had at the start. Maybe we need a leadership triad instead of one person at the top of our pyramid - this would mean shared responsibility, it would dilute the connection and it would mean we lived a little less hand to mouth. But I guess that would have to happen in the long term, because as I've said many times leaders emerge, they cannot be appointed, and even if everyone felt there was a need for this we couldn't just choose the two people who are most popular right now and sew them to Dan. I've no idea, this is really complicated, what do you guys think? --------------- wow, this started a large discussion. I didn't necessarily mean that we should take Dan down from the pedestal as leader, though I do feel like there is a bigger picture rather than what Dan is telling us to do. We should take control of certain things while he guides others. All I mean to say is that we have our own ideas and everything and that we aren't really 'followers' of Dan Brown. Dan did start this all and we should always let him be there to guide us but in truth- some things like declaring 'independence' increase the positive mentality of the tribe as a whole. We aren't declaring that we want to be our own independent group aside from Dan Brown, but what we should do is declare that we are equal to Dan Brown. We are equal to his leadership and thus he is also a part of our community as a whole. Think of a cell. The organelles respond to the nucleus but the nucleus isn't "above" them. Without the organelles the nucleus is useless and vice-versa. The nucleus is surrounded by the rest of the cell and is in turn, a part of it. We shouldn't declare that we are independent from 'Dan' but should declare that we as a whole (including Dan) and an independent cell. Something entirely different from the Dan Brown others know on Youtube. We should not declare independence from Dan Brown the individual but from from the Dan Brown everyone else knows. This is not a fan club rather it is a whole new thing started 'by' Dan Brown. Awesome post. Absolutely represents my feelings until I saw that post by Boris.
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Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
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Post by Deleted on Apr 21, 2010 16:21:17 GMT -5
Questions for you guys: Do you think that having a single leader makes him a representative of us for the world? No, but it does with Dan, as he has access to a lot of people through YouTube. If we had a single leader who wasn't "famous", it wouldn't. I do think we have multiple leaders though.Do you think that the things he says and does directly reflect on our community? Yes. He is influential, and he got us together, I find it only natural that he has influence on us. I don't think that's a bad thing, as it's not like he's telling us to follow him, but to discuss and to find our own path.Do you think that because of this the community has some personal stake in what he says? - some investment, some right, or some vulnerability We should have (and I think we have) stake in what he says concerning the Tribe and the Moon. Asides from that, no.Do you think that this means he has given up some kind of personal liberty because he represents us? - Do you think he is answerable to us? YesIf not do you think we give up something because we are associated as a tribe with every sentence he utters? N/ADo you think that his decorum should reflect us? What's decorum? But anyway, as for reflecting us, since our sentiment is "if you follow these base values, everyone is welcome", I think that he will always reflect us as long as he sticks to the basic values.Or that we should reflect him? Yes, as wellDo you think we should just ignore all this and have fun? No to ignoring, yes to having funHere is the post that got me thinking about it. I'M COMPLETELY SHOCKED!!!!!!!!! seriously, until I watch the Tea Party video I thought Dan was one of the most inteligent people on Earth, As I said in this post I wanted to create a Pogo Tribe site in spanish, I've already gathered the people and someone who puts the money. NOW I DON'T KNOW WHAT TO DO. I don't think this is a joke 'cuz I've just watched the gorila vid and he's in the same "state". He doesn't only look like a fool, but he brings down the whole Pogo Tribe reputation. Seriously, I don't know what to do with the project, and I'm sure the people from the project isn't happy either. I think it's rather ignorant to do this thing basically everyone has been doing: Judging Dan as if you know exactly what he's doing and as if your idea on what happening is a valid argument to either "follow" or "leave" him.
Also, I don't think it has a negative influence on the tribe. Remember "embrace your inner weird"? And also, he never mentioned that this is what the tribe believes, in fact he mentions the opposite.Quote from a poster who seems dedicated to the community and who wanted/wants to create a Spanish wing. Danielle made a good point in another thread that she felt that "people" (as if people had one mind which changed) were angry at Dan for making serious videos and then later angry at him for making fun ones. But of course it was different people each time. So my conclusion is that he can't please everyone so he should just please himself. (Oh behave!) I think it's not really fair on Dan that every video he makes has the potential to affect the community. the only thing that can keep us together is our diversity and our acceptance of each other and everything, our acceptance that we are a complete mixed bag but we just share common goals and values. The very fact that no matter what any of us does one of us isn't going to like it. But this doesn't cancel out all the questions I had at the start. Maybe we need a leadership triad instead of one person at the top of our pyramid - this would mean shared responsibility, it would dilute the connection and it would mean we lived a little less hand to mouth. But I guess that would have to happen in the long term, because as I've said many times leaders emerge, they cannot be appointed, and even if everyone felt there was a need for this we couldn't just choose the two people who are most popular right now and sew them to Dan. I've no idea, this is really complicated, what do you guys think? I think a leadership triad might be a good idea, but only for starters. Real leaders need to be born and supported by the tribe, not chosen.--------------- wow, this started a large discussion. I didn't necessarily mean that we should take Dan down from the pedestal as leader, though I do feel like there is a bigger picture rather than what Dan is telling us to do. We should take control of certain things while he guides others. All I mean to say is that we have our own ideas and everything and that we aren't really 'followers' of Dan Brown. Dan did start this all and we should always let him be there to guide us but in truth- some things like declaring 'independence' increase the positive mentality of the tribe as a whole. We aren't declaring that we want to be our own independent group aside from Dan Brown, but what we should do is declare that we are equal to Dan Brown. We are equal to his leadership and thus he is also a part of our community as a whole. Think of a cell. The organelles respond to the nucleus but the nucleus isn't "above" them. Without the organelles the nucleus is useless and vice-versa. The nucleus is surrounded by the rest of the cell and is in turn, a part of it. We shouldn't declare that we are independent from 'Dan' but should declare that we as a whole (including Dan) and an independent cell. Something entirely different from the Dan Brown others know on Youtube. We should not declare independence from Dan Brown the individual but from from the Dan Brown everyone else knows. This is not a fan club rather it is a whole new thing started 'by' Dan Brown. Awesome post. Absolutely represents my feelings until I saw that post by Boris. replied in there ^^
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